Mendele: Yiddish literature and language ______________________________________________________ Contents of Vol. 3.045 June 24, 1993 1) Introduction (Randy Kolko) 2) Various (Ellen Prince) 3) Wexler; Philologus (Zachary Baker) 4) Prayen and tetshn (Mikhl Herzog) 5) Sissle/tsitsel (Noyekh Miller) 1)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed Jun 23 16:36:04 1993 From: Randy Kloko Subject: Introduction My name is Randy Kloko. Ikh bin a goy--with a name like 'Kloko', you should expect a Klingon, already. I work as a rare book cataloger at Duke University; I deal with a lot of 17th-19th century German texts. My three chief passions are language, singing and humor. You can see why I'm interested in Yiddish. What little I know of Yiddish comes from reading Leo Rosten's books, a quick perusal of Weinreich's text and phrasebook, intense study of a 1967 Lou Jacobi LP called "The Yiddish are Coming!", and most recently, reading Salcia Landmann's "Jiddisch: Abenteuer einer Sprache". At least the anecdotes. I also sing with a group that recorded "Shnirele Perele". Finally, the only article I ever liked in the "German Quarterly" was a discussion on the best system for transcribing Yiddish. (The conclusion: "Why don't you just learn to read the Hebrew alphabet?") Which brings me to a practical concern. Which system of transcription is preferred here, since I can't use Hebrew characters anyway? A groyssn dank, Randy Kloko [For Khaver Kloko and others who have joined Mendele in the past year, here is a reprint of a very useful post by Zachary Harris.] Date: Monday, April 13, 1992 From: BM.YIB@RLG.BITNET Subject: YIVO transcription of Yiddish There are three handy tables for the YIVO transcription of Yiddish: (1) College Yiddish, by Uriel Weinreich (p. 26); (2) Modern English-Yiddish Yiddish-English Dictionary, also by Uriel Weinreich (English preface, p. xxi); and (3) Encyclopaedia Judaica, vol. 1 (Index vol.), p. 91. In the latter source, please ignore "ch" as an alternative trans- cription for "tes-shin." "Ch" should NEVER be used in ANY transcription or transliteration scheme aimed at English speakers. As an example of the confusion that this causes, see p. 15 of Chester G. Cohen's "Shtetl Finder" (Los Angeles: Perivale, 1980), where there are the following adjacent entries: Chmiliv (Chmielow, SW of Lublin) [pronounced KHMILIV]; Chmilov, Chemilov (Cmielow, SW of Lublin) [prounounced TSHMILOV or TSHMILEV] There is one other YIVO-based transcription/transliteration scheme for Yiddish, called ALA/LC (American Library Association/Library of Congress), which is used in virtually all card and online library catalogs in the U.S. The most visible difference between the YIVO and ALA/LC schemes is in their respective handling of "zayin-shin" = "zh" according to YIVO, and "zsh" according to ALA/LC. Thus, ALA/LC is closer than YIVO to a pure transliteration system. On the other hand, both systems transcribe, rather than trans- literate loshn-koydesh elements in Yiddish, although here, too, there are differences between YIVO and ALA/LC. For more information on ALA/LC romanization, see "Hebraica Cataloging: A Guide to ALA/LC Romanization and Descriptive Cataloging," prepared by Paul Maher (Washington, DC: Library of Congress, Cataloging Distribution Service, 1987). Zachary M. Baker, YIVO Library 2)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed Jun 23 17:57:23 1993 From: "Ellen F. Prince" Subject: Various to meylekh: apology graciously accepted. and i'm happy you're finally happy! to leo goldstein: uh, there's a perfectly good 'old theory', i.e. the classification of yiddish as a germanic language, sister of new high german, daughter of middle high german, with strong effects of language contact with semitic and (for eastern yiddish) slavic. so i'm a little confused about what data you have in mind that we need a new theory of... to bob: that's wonderful! and a great informant you've got there... (also sounds like a great baker.) ellen 3)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed Jun 23 21:41:45 1993 From: Zachary Baker (bm.yib@rlg.stanford.edu) Subjects: Wexler; Philologos (A) Thank you, one and all, for responding to my initial inquiry about Paul Wexler's theories. Doubtless my friend Reyzl K-W's posting was also a major factor in the spirited conversation. (B) Philologos: I asked the "Who is..." question back when I first signed on to MENDELE. [A conspiracy of?] silence greeted my inquiry. I know two individuals who claim to know the individual's identity, but are sworn to secrecy. Fie! -- or should I say, Feh! And then I have spoken to two others who say they know but whose claims conflict with each other. One says it's Gus Tyler (implausible -- far too initimate a knowledge of the day-to-day Israeli scene is found in "Philologos"); the other pronounces that it's Hillel Halkin (more plausible: HH writes under that byline for the Forward, he lives in Israel, and he translates from Yiddish and Hebrew into English), citing as his authority HH's mother. And then there's Reyzl's conjecture that Philologos is none other than Paul Wexler, although I have my doubts -- at least as far as the previous columns are concerned, since his romanization strays far from any of the recognized standards (then again, the plural of "Chasid" (i.e., Hasid, Khosed) in the Forward is "Chasids", so go know). On the basis of asides in earlier columns, we do know this about "Philologos": He's an American-born Israeli who made aliyah circa 1968. Any more guesses, folks? P.S. The Slobodyanski affair would fit very nicely into a Philip Roth plot (speaking of Phils). Zachary Baker, YIVO Library 4)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu Jun 24 07:27:29 1993 From: ZOGUR@CUVMB.Columbia.edu Subject: Prayen and tetshn Pe'rets Mett, et al: "prayen" (to rhyme with "kayen" 'to chew') is cognate with Fr. 'prier' and is the usual Western Yiddish word in the expression "mekhile prayen", 'to ask forgiveness (often/generally? of the deceased)'. It also occurs in the Dutch Yiddish proverb "ungeprayte gest zetst man bay di tir" ('uninvited guests--as at a wedding--are seated at the door'). "tetshn" (to rhyme with "kvetshn") means 'to blow' as in 'sho(y)fer tets Western Yiddish? Etymology? Will the Sadan Indexer out there check this too? Mikhl Herzog. 5)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu Jun 24 08:23:05 1993 From: nmiller@binah.cc.brandeis.edu Subject: Sissle/tsitsel Bob Hoberman may have solved the mystery (and warm thanks from us all for having done so) but there's always a new question: what is the the etymology of tsitsele as in tittie/nipple? Heb (tsits), OF (cf. ModF teton)? Efsher gor Sorbian? Noyekh ______________________________________________________ End of Mendele Vol. 3.045