Mendele: Yiddish literature and language ______________________________________________________ Contents of Vol. 07.165 March 8, 1998 1) grayz (Mikhl Herzog) 2) Tsebetsky's yurren (Irv Young) 3) Melekh Sobieski's yorn (Al Grand) 4) Sobieski's yurn (Wolf Krakowski) 5) openers (Mel Poretz) 6) openers (Dovid-Hirsh ben Aryeh-Leyb Roskies) 7) openers (David Herskovic) 8) openers (Hershel Bershady) 9) openers (Mel Goldstein) 1)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 7 Mar 1998 23:22:45 -0500 From: "Mikhl Herzog" Subject: grayz Re Sasha Englard's query about Yiddish _grayz_ [07.164]: I discussed the matter at length in one or more postings a number of years ago. I recall engaging in some controversy on the subject as well. Perhaps the editor can identify the issue(s) in which these discussions took place. I'd hate to go through it all again. Mikhl Herzog [Moderator's note: For the discussion on _grayz_ see volumes 1.158, 1.162, 1.168, and 3.033. -i.v.] 2)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 00:02:19 EST From: YOU 2 IG Subject: "Tsebetsky's yurren" Mel Poretz raises a question re "Tsebetsky's yurren". A possible connection may lie in the usage I remember. "Dos iz fun Melach Abetzky's tzeiten" to indicate age going back as far as rcorded history or beyond. Ver vais? My roots are from Grodno. On the subject of Adar and oder isn't oder simply the German word for other? Biz noch ammol-- Irv Young Isles of Capri, FL 3)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 09:17:02 EST From: Savoyid Subject: Melekh Sobieski's yorn In Mel Poretz's second installment of "delicious expressions that have resonated throughout [his] life" which his parents used [Vol. 07.164] he writes, " 'Tsebetsky's yurren' is a sump of an expression with too many applications to list here. I'd be interested in what Mendelyaners recall about it." Surely he's referring to the expression "Melekh Sobieski's yorn" used to indicate something that happened in ancient times as in "S'get tsurik tsu Melekh Sobieski's yorn." The reference is to John III Sobieski of Poland, most famous and perhaps most important of the elective kings of Poland- Lithuania, who restored his country to temporary greatness and saved Vienna from the Turks in 1683. I've also heard the expression misused as "Melekh Khabetski's yorn." Al Grand 4)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 08 Mar 1998 10:15:45 -0500 From: "Kame'a Media" Subject: Sobieski's yurn or more accurately or is roughly equivalent to "olden days" Or: "...during the reign of King Sobieski." Or: "in Sobieski's time/day/era." It is used to describe something ancient or something that happened long ago. John Sobieski was King of Poland from 1674 until 1696. He was a friend to the Jews, although he was often unable to intervene effectively in their behalf. Wolf Krakowski 5)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 06:25:53 EST From: EMPE Subject: vos makhstu? Did I miss it, or did no one come up with what I thought was the universal response to "vos makhstu?" (generally by women, but often by men, accompanied by ribald laughter), "Ikh makh a bris!" MEL PORETZ 6)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 08 Mar 1998 06:47:38 -0400 (EDT) From: daroskies@JTSA.EDU Subject: Openers: Vos hert zikh? Answer: Di velt kert zikh. (from my late father, Leyb Roskies) Respectfully submitted by Dovid-Hirsh ben Aryeh-Leyb David Roskies 7)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 08 Mar 1998 10:51:54 +0000 From: David Herskovic Subject: openers Here are some more replies to the enquiry 'vos hert zikh?' di babe yert zikh vos men zogt hoykh freyg beser nisht in velkhn pekl? es besert zikh And of course, borekh hashem fayn. David Herskovic 8)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 10:01:34 -0500 (EST) From: hbershad@sas.upenn.edu (Harold Bershady) Subject: openers One of my grandparents' landsleit, on replying to 'vos makhst du?,' would to my delight, invariably say: "Mi shmekt nisht, mi shtinkt nisht." Of course others would also say, with equal invariability: "Mi lebt und mi mitchisekh." Those others clearly stopped to shmek. Hershel Bershady 9)---------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 20:17:52 +0200 (EET) From: Melvin Goldstein Subject: openers Wishing to join the contributors to [Mendele Vol 07.163], I recall my father's response, delivered only after he had reached an appropriate age. In response to "vos makht a yid?", he would answer: "kinder makh ikh yets nisht." Mel Goldstein Beer Sheva ______________________________________________________ End of Mendele Vol. 07.165 Address for the postings to Mendele: mendele@lists.yale.edu Address for the list commands: listproc@lists.yale.edu Mendele on the Web: http://mendele.commons.yale.edu http://sunsite.unc.edu/yiddish/mendele.html