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Session:         Page of 592

in Westchester. It was a big story. Remember Wechsler is still there. The Times made it a very big story, and all the papers and the media would cover it. Particularly, we'd always have arrests on weekends, see, so people would be coming down to cover it.

I don't know what else I can tell you about the administration.

Q:

I have a specific question and it relates to a problem that I think is inherent in all amalgamated type locals, which is that when each work place is only a chapter rather than a local unto itself, then you really do have a problem finding ways of enabling the membership to be involved with decisions for the local as a whole. This was certainly true in any teamster local, for instance, where, say, Local 337 in Detroit, maybe they had a stewards council, but Bobby Holmes made all the decisions because you had 300 different workplaces, and how could the guys know anything that was happening? So I'm wondering about that problem, if you were conscious of it at the time, if it concerned you, or how you think it played out in the long run.

Foner:

The executive council, which consists of the elected people, is the real decision-making body, because when you go to delegate assemblies, you go to a group of -- at that time maybe it's 200. We're not in the new building, so it's a packed hall, 250 people. They're hospital workers. They're new to organization. First of all, you can't have a serious discussion with 250 people, so you have reports that are approved all the time and always somebody is going to get up to speak, “Aye, Aye, Davis is wonderful,” you know, that kind of thing, and, “We should do this and do that.” The organizational forms are not effective on that level. They can be effective only to the degree that on the job the organizer can develop stewards who can take care of things. That's a difficult kind of thing. That depends upon the ability of the organizer and his ability to involve stewards, delegates. That's complicated because, on the one hand, in most cases the organizer does not want to involve stewards; he wants to do it himself because it looks better that way. He wants to show everybody he knows more than the steward. So it takes a very, very special kind of organizer to be able to do that kind of thing. I'm thinking of a Mark Levy. These are names that come to my mind. Mark Levy -- and we had many people like him going over the years, who were very effective in organizing, in administering, in servicing people so that they knew that they trained them, or they trained staff on how to work with stewards. That's the key thing. But for the most part, we were bringing on staff people who had just been hospital workers. This whole thing was brand-new to them. They knew very little about how you run an organization. We were, for the first time, beginning to run a big organization. We had a



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