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We were on civil rights and also the Israel question at the end last time. I was going to ask you if you had ever made a trip to Israel yourself.

Yes, I have been to Israel on two different occasions. One was in November of 1973 immediately after the October war, and more recently when I went as a member of the Appropriations Sub-Committee on Foreign Operations, and I went with Joe Early and Dave Obey, and we went to the Mideast and we went to Portugal -- first to Portugal, then to Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Israel. It was a fascinating trip.

Incidentally, did you encounter any difficulties in the Arab countries?

Well, first we were traveling as an official group. We were accompanied by a State Department person who came with us. In Egypt I was very impressed with Sadat, and I did a whole report on this, which if you're interested, is available. It was a remarkable trip.

I went frankly because Dave Obey is very bad on Israel.