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of money was spent where nothing in particular happened, as far as I can see.

Those constant trips to Washington on your part paid off.

They paid off. They paid off. The world owes me nothing. Something has happened that's going to make it possible for many more people to eat and we hope many more people to survive.

Now, on the interferon front: I think I told you that Mrs. Blair and Mr. Fordyce and Dr. Gutterman and I went to see John Burns and Hoffman-LaRoche on June 15th, 1978, to tell him that with the Cantell type interferon, which we had purchased from Cantell in Finland, the Finnish Red Cross, he had had responses in about 25% of the breast cancers he had treated, which was not very many but it was about 15, in myelomas and in several other kinds of cancer. Now, the Cantell type of interferon was only one-tenth of one percent pure; and so we said to Burns: “If you could clean this, and this is only a tenth of one percent pure -- if it's pure, you might get a very much better result.” So he said well, they were interested in interferon but they didn't have the blood. You need an enormous amount of blood to purity this substance out of it. And so Gutterman said, “I'll send you the blood from M.B. Anderson every day or twice a week whenever you need it.” And he did. And they were able to purify the interferon, leukocyte interferon...