Part: 1234         Session: 12345         Page 385386387388389390391392393394395396397398399400401402403404405406407408409410411412413414415416417418419420421 of 512

sympathies -- I've already said to you -- for the peace movement of the people who were advocating a -- Well, the political peace movement. Let's put it that way -- people who were advocating much stronger efforts as we saw it on the part of the administration to reach a settlement. But the business of running over the border to avoid the draft I didn't have much or any sympathy with. I certainly was not an advocate of that.

Let me turn the tape off for just a second.

[TAPE INTERRUPTION]

Well, I'm sure from time to time that -- Well, I'm not sure, but let me ask you. From time to time, I'm wondering, you know, what were the internal discussions at the paper over the positions on Vietnam, particularly the editorials? Were there maybe discussions at publisher's luncheons? Did you have occasion to discuss things with the editors of the New York Times? Those kinds of issues. How was it being handled?

My impression is quite strongly -- it would be very hard to document, by the way -- but my impression is very strongly that, while my --

We weren't picking up well on the mic. So -- I was asking you about the internal discussions of Vietnam. Of course, you can't pin that down exactly, but at the paper, publisher's luncheons, other occasions.

Well, my strong recollection is that especially in the earlier period of the early '60s, let's say, into the middle, maybe even longer than the early '60s, that most of the executives