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the country -- which, of course, a lot of people did, mistakenly, because I really think those two things could and should go together -- but in any case, Bush would always come out on the economic interest side that appealed, basically, to the mainstream Republican party rather than on the environmental side. And although I haven't read that piece you're referring to in a long, long time, I'm just as sure as I'm sitting here, from the title, that that is the point that it makes.

Q:

Yes. And it was about the refusal to sign the treaty cutting down on the CD emissions.

Oakes:

Well, that's exactly the thing. Although that was an extremely important thing that should have been done, it had some economic implications that Bush always felt, with the full support of the Republican mainstream -- and, of course, support from plenty of Democrats, too -- felt that the adverse economic implications were much more important for the United States than the environmental benefits. Reduction of emissions eventually had to be imposed, anyway.

Q:

Exactly. Well, I thought maybe I'd like to give a little bit of time to asking you, outside the newspaper, outside your columns, outside your Op-Ed pieces, something about your involvement in the environmental movement. Some of your personal involvement outside the newspaper. You had a membership in several organizations.

Oakes:

You mean in NRDC [National Resources Defense Council] and things like that?

Q:

Yes. Your activities on Martha's Vineyard, or whatever.



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