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When I started taking extension (I had to amass 15 points to get into Columbia) I quickly decided after looking the field over that I could never learn any Latin or Greek. I had none at all. And I discovered that at the School of Journalism you didn't need Latin or Greek. So then and there I decided that the Columbia School of Journalism was for me. It was then an undergraduate school. It became a graduate school some years later.

But you did get your B.A. there, didn't you?

I got my B.A. at Columbia College and my B. Lit. at the School of Journalism. I did both. I started wheeling and dealing when I got into college. That was the real start of my career.

Did you meet any of your present friends at this time?

Yes. In Extension, a couple of things happened to me that were important. First of all, Morty Rodgers had the next locker to me in gym class, and we became friends immediately; we've been friends ever since. I went home with him, and there was little Dick, and Morty's father, Dr. Rodgers to me. Dr. Rodgers was a very famous man because one of his patients was my dream girl, Norma Talmadge. Do you remember Norma Talmadge?

No, I don't, but--