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interestingly enough. Russian psychologists are very monistic, in the sense that they make no distinction between the sacred mind, volitional, and physiological, neuro-physiological, psychopharmocological determinants of mind.

In this regard, they may be well in advance of Americans, in this kind of research, that is admittedly dangerous. I mean, I don't want to underplay for a moment the tremendous power that would be involved in this kind of knowledge and technology.

If students question what you just said about the Russians, where does this leave the old Pavlovian concept?

It certainly doesn't contradict, because the Pavlovian is merely an external manipulation of organic changes. And I'm sure the Russians, if not American psychologists, have been experimenting with a facilitation of the external conditioning by biochemical reinforcements.

Luria, when he came here, oh, about 20 years ago, made this point very clearly, but apparently it went over the heads of most psychologists. What he was saying, he was giving a summation of the direction of Russian psychological research, before the American Orthopsychiatric Association. And the point that I took away from Luria's talk was: “Look, we are moving in the direction of organismic -- not moving but our whole thrust is in the direction of organismic approach to psychology.”

Their experiments on the mentally deficient involved drugs, and medication-- I guess that's a more acceptable term.