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Well, I am the person who's tentatively the director. Because I can't physically -- Esther represents us there. My brother Henry is working on the project for them and also Taminent.

Taminent Library?

The Taminent Library.

Now, let's see what the next thing -- oh, I just wanted to mention in passing the kind of things we do in our gallery and the reactions. There's an organization in New York that does programming for schools, a very large organization that gets big funding, and they did a program which was an exhibition that opened in our gallery and has been touring. Community Works is the organization, and the exhibition is called “The Long Walk to Freedom, 1900-1999: Portraits of Civil Rights Activists Then and Now.” The exhibition opened in our gallery and since has been traveling to exhibition sites around the city. Right now it's at the Brooklyn Public Library. It's been at like banks and Citicorp and major schools, and I am one of the civil rights activists included, together with people like Bob Moses, Carolyn Goodman, Wyatt T. Walker, Roberta Yancey. And I continually get calls from people who say, “I just saw your photograph in this exhibition.”

I saw it at the World Financial Center.

Right. So, you know, that's another outreach, and it's Bread and Roses that did it. All the interviews that were done with the students who developed the project were done with me or with different people. I came and they interviewed me for two hours on Bread and Roses and 1199 and the role we played in the civil rights movement with Dr. King in 1959. So that's another kind of project we do.

Bread and Roses has for years had member committees that help design the agenda for Bread and Roses programming, is that correct?

Yes, it had them. But in recent years, in the last year, it's been very greatly expanded, particularly when our staff grew -- we're still a very small staff -- with Esther and Bill. They have -- Bill is --

How small a staff? How many full-time employees have you got?

We have three full-time employees.

For all those programs.

It's incredible.