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the state of New York if she was our Senator, a tragedy for the country and a tragedy for the Democratic party and a tragedy for the freshmen Congressmen who will be running with her at the top of the ticket, and I believe that if there isn't someone who comes in other than those now mentioned, that she'll win the primary and lose the general election to Jim Buckley.

Now, I'm interviewed by a reporter, Tom Ronan, who comes down regularly to Washington to do stories on the delegation. And I'm the secretary to the delegation, so he always comes in and chats with me. And he said, “What do you think about the Senate race?” So I said, “I'll analyze it for you.” He said, “For attribution?” I said, “Certainly for attribution.” I said, “The people who are running -- Bella Abzug, Ramsey Clark, major candidates -- are perceived as left-left. And the state of New York, the city of New York, is not left-left. If anything, it's moderate conservative. And Jim Buckley is very popular. He is more conservative than is the state, but people like him because he's a stand-up guy, he says what he believes, he's got a marvelous personality, and they like him. And as between left-left and a guy on the right, they're going to take the guy on the right. Therefore, if we're going to win, it's got to be someone who is perceived as a moderate but who is a liberal. The best illustration of someone who is a liberal but is perceived as a moderate,” I said to him, “is Hugh Carey. Hugh Carey -- Irish Catholic, 12 children -- who's going to believe that he's a