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describe the pattern of people who are victims of severe arthritis.

I hadn't realized that that was related to emotional...

Yes, well, he has related it, and certainly in the case of ulcers and asthma, most intelligent physicians take it as a matter of course that there are emotional factors.

And certain types of skin diseases.

And allergies, too, yes.

Later he went on to--in 1954--I tried to interest him in studying emotional factors of cancer of the breast or having him study it at the Institute of Psychoanalysis in Chicago, and there was indeed a study begun at this time in which a small number of women who had breast cancer were analyzed. The number of people was not large enough to bring any firm conclusions but their life situations were ones of great stress, and when I read some of them, I was surprised they didn't die at once and not even have to be killed by cancer.

Was it simply this, I mean your knowledge of the difficult lives of various people, which led you to urge this kind of research?

I knew that peoples were victims of great distress and