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Well, they have also in the making ... Genentech has cloned immune interferon, which is a form that they see may be effective alone or when used with other types of leukocyte interferon. It will simulate the immune system.

This is Hoffmann has done this?

Yes, well, Genentech is doing it in collaboration with Hoffmann. Hoffmann-LaRoche has been very generous about giving leukocyte interferon to a large number of clinical centers so that places like Memorial and M. D. Anderson at Houston, Texas, can do clinical trials of interferon on various kinds of cancer. And they indeed have done a number of types of cancer.

So this indicates real cooperation.

Yes. Well, from a drug company it's very remarkable, that they're not trying to sell it -- they're giving it -- so that eventually all the places they're giving it to will publish a paper that puts together all their experiences, which will be very exciting.

And they'll all benefit by this anyway.

Eventually they'll benefit by it because everybody will say they've had their own experience -- “Let's buy Roche interferon.” Don't you think?

Roche will sell it throughout the world and as a nasal spray for the common cold.