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see the President rigged up one of these wartime fantasies of administration in order to give Byrnes a post high enough. It was a high enough sounding title, you see, to justify his leaving the Court.

Now remember, Miss Perkins, Byrnes was indeed acting in large capacities then.

Before this was formed?

No - from about December of 1942 right up to the beginning of 1945. In very great capacity. It was he who chopped off Wickard's head, you see

Oh yes. Well, he certainly was active.

And to get a Secretary of Agriculture, you have to have pretty big guns.

Oh he had great influence with Roosevelt. I'm note saying he didn't.

He had enormous influence with Roosevelt.

I mean, he had enormous influence, but - well, I wondered about it. I never had questioned the quality of it,