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Oh, that was Implicit in how he loaned it.

I don't know why he did it that way, but that was his idea of the way to do it. It worked out all right, and he ended in a blaze of glory. Roosevelt used to say, “You know, the name of Jesse is the same as the name of Jesus.”

“Jesus Jones.” You know, he would laugh about him like that. And he always was teasing him about being a skin- flint, you see, and teasing him about his nefarious operations. “Oh, I'm making money, Mr. President. I'm making money. I'm making money for the Government.” And it was that sort of teasing back and forth. I don't think Roosevelt disliked him personally.

You don't? You think they got along all right?

No, I don't. Well, they got along right in public, and he never put Jesse Jones to the test. He didn't expect him to be a New Dealer. But Jesse Jones was all right. I mean, he went along with all the New Deal operations. He never balked at anything that I had to do with.

As a matter of fact, Jesse Jones gave me more help in the Department of Labor, in my problems, than any other single member of the Cabinet except Jim Farley. Those two men helped me out of any number of scrapes and troubles-particularly when it came to settling labor disputes and strikes.