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few who were big because they were in athletics, and they were prominent in athletics.

Now, when you were having this trouble with math, you could have switched to a major other than psychology. What really swung you to psychology, besides your husband-to-be's recommendation?

Well, I'd always had an interest in children. Always, from the time I was very small. I'd always though I wanted to work with children, and psychology seemed a good field. I wasn't interested in teaching as such, in going into education, and psychology seemed to offer a potential in several different areas. I was interested in abnormal psychology, and that potentially was an area in which you could work in mental hospitals, or -- you know, work in specialized settings, with children. I was interested in the educational aspect of psychology, to be a school psychologist and work with children in elementary schools. The field had potentially more opportunities to work with children, and it was very compatible with my interest in children.

Was this rationale something that you developed pretty much on your own, or was it largely influenced by Kenneth Clark, or was it a blend?

I would say it was a blend. I would say it was a blend. At that time he wasn't interested in children, at that time. And it was a blend, because he opened up this whole area for me, and I began to see what I was going to do with myself.