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Well --

Or even before the end? Not just after he left Congress, but when he --

-- no, I don't think he betrayed his race. I really don't. I just think he made some stupid moves, and that probably many of the whites in Congress were making those same moves, but they were more astute about it. I don't think he betrayed the race.

I'm thinking here, it wasn't just your husband that he got in a large fight with that became public, but I have personally heard him attack Martin Luther King, on a street corner, Seventh Avenue. I heard him attack A. Philip Randolph, when Randolph was in the process of founding the Negro American Labor Council. I don't recall I ever heard him publicly attack Malcolm X, but I understand they were getting along for ra while and suddenly they were apart.

I don't think he betrayed the race. I think all that could take place without a betrayal of the race. No, he just made a stupid error, in the end.

Which error are you thinking of here?

I mean the eroor that he made in Congress, in taking a woman abroad on the taxpayers' money. I'm sure he made more serious ones than that, but that seemed to be the beginning of the end. And that business with the Bag Lady was a mistake. He didn't have to call her “The Bag Lady.”