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other outside activity.

We'll talk about it.

We'll talk about it another time. But I bring it up because it is related. Everybody says, “Well, why didn't you hire minorities?” A: they were damn difficult to find, and B: the daily cultural shock is something that few people understood. If you were really going to try to hire them you would have to do something so different for them that in itself could cause problems. Because you would then again be separating them again. It's like a little bit like at college when the first big efforts were made to bring blacks into colleges. They lived in the same dorm, they all ate together. Now this is dissipating. But that's what it was. The troubles in '68 were of that nature. So we were lousy, [laughing] So you know, and Mea Culpa.

But you, I mean woul-

And I was probably more understanding about this whole thing than most anybody else in our company, or elsewhere because my outside interests had led me to begin to understand what the problem was about, not what the answers were.

Do you think the problem was more acute at Time Inc. because there you were searching primarily, at least on the editorial side, for people with word and writing skills, and the fact that in the