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Yes. In fact, the lay people would tend to be Harvard graduates, because you want that inherent interest, and the academics cannot be Harvard--as a matter of fact, you're not allowed to have a Harvard person there. You get only outsider academics.

So you where also in the process of this dealing with all of the deans of the various parts of the university, heads of departments and--

Sure, because every visiting committee had to deal with the chairman of the place or the dean or the director of the center--there're a good number of centers at Harvard. That turned out to be very interesting. By then I'd learned something about this unruly group of people, and realized that somehow you had to get people with more discipline into the place and make it more cohesive. And this was also the time when we were organizing the 250 million dollar capital drive, which ended up as a 350 million dollar capital drive. So by means fair and foul, I would manage to get the Harvard Alumni Association directors to put together a slate of ten people, all of whom would be acceptable, would work well.

A very strange fact about the alumni who vote is that they tend to be the older ones, and you would think, would tend to be the more conservative ones. What they'll always vote for is a minority, a woman, or somebody radical [laughter]. Inevitable. So, I didn't exactly pack the slate, but I attempted to ensure that whoever got elected was, as far as I was concerned--they were all perfectly