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Whether he wanted a primary or not, at that moment I didn't care about. I only knew it would be terrible to have Dick Kuh, and as I think I told you: Dick Kuh lives in my house. So of course I said, “Sure, Nick, I'd be happy to call,” and he asked me to call Mike Whitman I think is the guy's name: he used to be the counsel to Governor Wilson, if I have his name correct. And I called him. And I said, “I understand the governor is considering Kuh and Scoppetta, and the question is whether or not the selection by him of either of the two would stop the primary.” Would everybody agree that would be okay? because they don't want a primary election if they can avoid it for such a sensitive position.

I said, “One way to insure a primary is to put in Kuh. Then you'll get everybody in the reform movement out there against him, including me.”

He said nothing and then the governor appoints Kuh. Ultimately it was clear what the strategy was: of course, the governor wants a primary -- it would tie up our energies so that we wouldn't have any energy against him, because he was going to be involved in a general election. And a primary in the Democratic party is helpful to a Republican who's running for office even though it's for a different position, because primaries bring out the worst and the best in people. You never forgive your enemies in that area. I don't anyway.