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en endorsement but just to get some advice, just to talk with you about things.” Then comes all the things that candidates or people in office love to hear how brilliant they are, and he wants my advice because I've got this great acumen as a public officeholder, politician.

So I said okay. How can you say no to some who wants to just talk and get advice if you've known him over the years? John Lankenau as I told you, was his roommate and he said to me... He didn't like van den Heuvel either, and the reason was that he had roomed with van den Heuvel here in the Village after they'd gotten out of school, and then they had each taken their own apartments, and then he was getting invited to certain parties and he found out that van den Heuvel had two lists -- an “A” list and a “B” list -- and John, a close friend and a roommate, was being invited to the “B” list, which was the secondary list, and he never got over that. That's the nature of van den Heuvel. He would use you and use his connections in a way that offends me and certainly offended John.

Okay. So he comes. He came to this apartment. He sits down -- coffee -- talk a little bit about various things that have taken place; I can't even remember that part of it. And then he says, “Ed, you know, I really want your endorsement.” So I said, “Well, Bill, I'm not getting involved in that.” And then he said, “But, you know, Ed, there's no reason why you shouldn't. When you compare the people that are in that race,