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of Education; John W. Gardiner of the Carnegie Foundation: Albert Sims and Frank Bowles.

Legislation for this university was drafted.

Was Johnson present at their meeting?

He came into the meeting. I doubt that he spent the day or whatever length of time they spent, because he couldn't and didn't have the patience to spend any length of time on the details of a project.

The legislation was drafted and the bill passed, and about 10 million dollars, as I recall it, was allocated to make funds available to initiate the university. It had some difficulty in the beginning, getting off the ground, but I've heard in recent times that it has started to develop, and I hope that when I go to Hawaii I will have a chance to go to see it, because certainly without the help we provided through David Lloyd there would have been nothing of this kind. It was an idea of Johnson's which he just didn't have time to get the work done on.

When the committee considered this subject, Mrs. Lasker, did they discuss at all the problem which one seems to observe with foreign students coming, say, to New York and elsewhere. They come for a stated period of time and do their work, but then they don't want to go back.