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plot. You know, as if he were paranoid about the whole thing. And this confused these other people, who weren't very interested but who get human feelings, and once you hear people that are hostile, you think, have they something real to be hostile about? Or they finally then will grasp, maybe by next year, that he's really very exaggeratedly hostile for some personal reason. You know?

Now, here is a case in point where your ability as a public speaker would be most helpful. I mean, to refute a man --

I don't speak at a meeting like that at all. He just spoke to me, and I had to reply to him. I just introduce the people and that's it. I don't say anything, because I feel that if you have doctors there and you are too articulate, it puts the doctors and the other men in a bad mood. Unless I were very, very effective, I would hesitate to do that. An effective speaker. If I were an effective speaker, I wouldn't

They're hostile to women. After all, there are only eighteen women in the Congress out of four hundred and thirty-five men. They really don't -- none of them have good -- are chairmen of important committees, and they don't have any power in the Congress.

And a few of them are rather able women too.

They're able, but they don't have power. But O'Neill really wanted -- O'Neill sees the point and O'Neill is with us on this. And I think he was very startled by this turn with Obey, and he said, listen, that he agreed with me that more money was needed and he didn't understand the attitude that it wasn't, because Obey's idea