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Well, these reactions on the part of people?

On the part of people; yes.

-- say something last year about intending to interest the American Red Cross in this whole effort.

Yes. Now, I'll tell you, in addition to what I said, I did persuade Senator Pepper to hold a hearing on high blood pressure and aging, the end of January 1979. The Red Cross testified that they were very interested, that they did screen a lot of older people. We had 15 excellent witnesses, and I really should give you the hearings for this, and for --

-- witnesses before this hearing in addition to the Red Cross people?

Oh yes. There was Dr. Mike DeBakey. Mike Gorman, Dr. Moser, and Ann Landers, Mr. James Evans of the Union Pacific as a businessman, Mr. Stanton as the head of the Red Cross, Dr. Iskovitz of Milwaukee, who led a great effort in Milwaukee, which lowered the death rate from stroke and heart, and a group of others. I'll send you the testimony.

All right, Fine. You mentioned Mike Gorman. How active is he these days?

Mike Gorman is the paid head of the Citizens for the