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Labor if I'd wanted to. It's easy to do, because, first, you utilize employees of the Department of Labor and assign them to a task like this. That takes care of the leg work and brain work. Then you call the people that you've brought in as advisers' “consultants” and you put them on a per diem. If they don't want to go on a per diem, if they're giving their services to their country, you can always arrange to pay their expenses. But I took it that these people were down in Washington permanently, or were down for long periods of time. They weren't just down for a few hours one day. That being the case, they probably were needing at least an expense account. Take a man like Tugwell; I don't suppose he could afford to blow himself to a long period in Washington unless he was on an expense account. There were several others in that category.

There were no high public officers there. There was no one who was known to the world to be authorized to do this kind of thing. I'm sorry that I can't remember the faces of the others who were there, but there must be others who would know that.

What I recall was this wrangling over the legal points, and the impatience, for instance, of Johnson. Tugwell said almost nothing. I remember being impressed with that. Although in my opinion, as I looked around, he was the most learned