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representative of a Pittsburgh paper. He always used to call him “our relative” and say, “Why didn't they let our relative take his case up?” Anyhow, this Mr. Perkins, whoever he may be, ran some kind of a very small shop, employing only five or six people, but he made something which really did enter into interstate commerce, and they should have taken his case up.

One of the problems in the Schechter case was the question of whether the chicken ever actually entered into interstate commerce and at what point it entered into interstate commerce. The Perkins man was an individualist. I've always thought that he probably extracted from New England and that he was a professing and practising individualist. Anything that interfered with him made him very, very angry. He wasn't going to do it. He didn't care whether it was harming him or not harming him. “You aren't going to tell me how to plant my garden!” I've seen it over and over again in New England when the people from the State Department of Agriculture come around and try to tell the farmers what to use for fertilizer, and so on. They wouldn't do it under any circumstances. They know how to plant a garden, or whatever it is they're going to do. They're against it the minute they hear that somebody is trying to tell