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He was a man of very meager education, you know, who just came up the rough way and got control of some oil here and there. I'd heard about Pat Hurley when I was out in Oklahoma. Who was it? Governor Marlin of Oklahoma told me a lot about Pat Hurley. And I'd heard about him in Texas. I'd never heard about him before, but I'd heard about him out there, you see, as a high-binder in the oil business-- the man who was putting the Humble Oil Company right out of business. I mean, you know, he was going to wipe them off the earth. And he did take over three or four oil companies by one device or another.

That was all he was, to my way of thinking. I never knew anything else. I never knew he had any other interests or activities other than the oil business. That's all he stood for, in my knowledge of him.

This is a very interesting story. Shortly before he went out to China--of course, by this time he'd sort of come into prominent view. He was apparently consulted by various people about various things, and of course oil was very important, and I daresay that was what he was consulted about. But on one occasion, Mrs. Hurley was giving a large tea-party in the afternoon to a lot of Washington ladies. I don't remember whether I was invited or not, but anyhow I didn't go. I think I was, but it was impossible. I never went to tea-parties.