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These ideas began to come, at least into the Cabinet circle, during the war, and they came from people who'd been to Chungking, you see.

Then there was the terrific scandal over Lend- lease, right after the war.

Yes. The materials had never reached their destination, you see. All that kind of thing. But that sort of disillusionment had begun. You know, everything was not just as it should be, and the Soong family were enriching themselves. Who was the woman who owned so much--the other Soong sister? Anyhow, she owned practically half of China, Madame Kung did. She was a tremendous operator. She was undoubtedly very rich, and how she had enriched herself, nobody knows.

Of course, I think you have to judge them by a different standard. I mean, you judge them by a Chinese standard and a Chinese pattern and background, and so forth--although these Soong sisters were supposed to be Christians and to have had a Christian education. Theoretically, they would have had an ethical standard at least similar to our own.

It was true. I remember people saying, “We'll never get the oil. We'll never get the tung oil.”

I remember Frank Knox saying that one day. “We'll never