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Percy Sutton, who is the past Borough president of Manhattan, past Assemblyman, and now he's a broadcast mogul of sorts, is he not?

Sure. Inner City Broadcasting.

Is this still doing polling?

Yes, when we get around to it. When we get clients.

Did you find it particularly difficult to set up samples for your polling?

Oh, sure. When we started we were the first ones to try to get a national sample of blacks, and it was really difficult and expensive.

Did you call for advice from certain of the established pollsters such as--

[Louis] Harris.

[ ] Roper and Lou Harris?

Yes, but didn't get very far. So we had to set up our own. We had such contractors polling many of whom we had worked with Harris.