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raising.

Well, when Larry said to us, and demonstrated that he had the facts, on this, we said, “OK. It's risky -- when you take on the American Jewish Committee, you're going to have to --”

Larry, by the way, is Jewish. And was clobbered on this. They called him all sorts of names.

But I think that if that man Bard had not raised this moonlighting issue, I might still be directing the Metropolitan Applied Research Center. I really think so. And I know that that sounds childish, except that I think it's true. I think that I over-reacted, in terms of somebody else. Obviously I didn't overreact in terms of myself.

That was about two years ago, two or three years ago, I think, and I have all the correspondence on that.

We didn't slow down on MARC. We didn't retreat one inch on that, and it's interesting that --

By the way, I can tell you how long ago. Mayor Beame was controller. This was a year or so before he threw his hat into the ring for mayor, and one of the young men who's working with me in my venture, Dave Palmer and I went down and had a meeting with Beame, on this particular issue.

See, what we were trying to demonstrate is that the members of the Board of Education were really not free to protect the public's interest, that they had other involvements, they had other priorities, We were showing that two or three of them had wives or daughters who were teachers, and we were saying, “Look, dammit-- the interests