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my sponsor, because I thought he was exploiting the students in that way. He had a long string of publications, and the students really didn't get the credit that they should have, as they did the work. So I wouldn't do that, and I told my husband that we were going to do this together.

So after we came to New York, or after I came to New York, we applied for a Rosenwald Fellow ship, and that gave us some money to live on, and at the same time enabled us to continue this work, and that was when he came in, to work with children. At that point.

And it was he who did most of the actual work in the field, for the publications that we had later, because at that time I would have been having children, going to school too.

But I think I influenced him, to get into the area of children.

To go back to the subject of your Master's thesis, and the -- how you established, when children became aware of their blackness. To what extent here were you also reacting against any poverty conditions that you saw surrounding these children ?

I was not really reacting to the poverty conditions -- at least for the purposes of the paper, I was not. I was really single track about it. My husband had introduced me to (Gene or Eugene) Horowitz, his name at the time -- he was later called Hartley -- and his wife at, was it Columbia or City College? I don't remember where they were at the time. But they had done a little piece of research in this same area, using an integrated group in the North, and they had hinted at the same thing, but it wasn't clearcut