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middle to right wing American corporations were backing a new outfit called the American Enterprise Institute, which was their creation. And they were pouring lots of money down that particular drain at the expense of so called liberal left wing organization, Brookings. So by enticing people into Becoming trustees of Brookings and contributing to Brookings, we gradually sort of changed the image. And Brookings is now again accepted by most everybody as being a centrist organization. And I managed to get the corporate support up from, I think it was just a few hundred thousand dollars a year, to about two and a half million. And that made a considerable difference, i.e., if they didn't have the two and a half million they would have had to have terrible cut backs in staff. They'd had some cut backs in staff, but they'd of had a bad one. And actually we've increased the staff a bit in the last few years. And it was a very stimulating experience because, again, you're dealing with a lot of very bright people and listening to them talk about various subjects. John Steinbrenner is probably as good on Russian relations and the nuclear issues as any man in the country. He and Talbot, from Time are the two, are the two great experts, very similar. But young people are good. Maybe forty. Forty is young isn't it? Anyway, that's about their-

But, is that where you met McNamara?