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issues that were all closing at a different time and so on.

Do you remember the first time you met him?

I'm not sure that this is the first time I met him or not, but he decided that he should have a lunch with the new editor and he had, I don't know--five or six people, including Billings and Longwell and a fellow by the name of Eric Hodgihs there. And they all were quizzing me all through lunch, and I was answering, and I thought doing extraordinarily well, making up answers to questions when I didn't know the answers. And it was only about three weeks later that I discovered that Eric Hodgins was a graduate of M.I.T. and had taught there [laughter].

So he saw through you.

That was upstairs in the Chrysler building in the Cloud Club--very fancy.

What was the Cloud Club used for, just mostly for Henry Luce's lunches?

The Cloud Club was for businessmen, and they had dining rooms--

On top of the Chrysler building?