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structure in Time Incorporated. Treatment of women, or you name it. I guess what characterized him was very selective thinking. He would think about one subject, and then there would be a cut, and then he'd think about another subject and they didn't tend to get mixed up.

This recalls what you said about operating on separate planes, the theoretical and the practical, in a way.

Yes, I guess so.

You've brought up women. What was his--interesting thing, married to Clare Luce on the one hand, who was as independent a woman as one would find and way out of line for her era. So, with that in mind, what do you think his attitude towards women at Time Inc. was? And what roles they should play?

Again, I don't think he ever thought about it, unless it happened to be the subject that he was thinking about for that hour. And he would think about it for that hour, and maybe write a memorandum or something like that, and then he just went on to something else.

But you're saying also that there wasn't follow through in his concept thoughts? Are you saying that?

There often wasn't. Because he didn't have that much follow through.