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out in the federal relief program had their origin in the things he was trying to do in New York State.

At any rate, he came to know the Governor somewhat. I don't think it was ever a very close relationship. I really don't remember them together, except when there was a committee or report and ten or twenty people would see him. Hopkins would be there telling him about what he had done or how the relief was going. I don't think that they were close in that period at all. I doubt if the Governor saw him half a dozen times. There were many, many things going on in the State of New York. This was an emergency thing that had to be done and Hopkins seemed to be doing it to the satisfaction of all hands.

The Governor also knew Bill Hodson who later became the Relief Administrator of the City of New York and who even then was trotting up to Albany with every committee that went up about relief and was one of the prime movers and spokesmen of the group that wanted the Governor to institute an emergency relief system for New York State. Hodson was head of the Welfare Council at that time. As such, of course, he had the most influential position in private charities in New York and had the backing of very good people. When he spoke, he spoke for a large number of respected citizens. He had a good deal of influence in the