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How did that two and a half million dollars gift in honor of Brook Astor get to you. Did he call you, or did you call him?

As a matter of fact, it was Gregorian and Dick Solomon who called on him. And I forget who got the brilliant idea to do it in honor of Brook. It turned out to be something that enchanted both David and Brook. As a double play.

You said he was on that original executive committee for the Urban Coalition.

Yes.

You've known this man for years, how committed has he, deep down, been to, you know, trying to eradicate poverty, social justice, what ever you want to call it.

I can't think of anybody more committed. He has devoted endless hours and time to this, and you may, or may not agree with his particular form of doing it, but I suppose that he, was partly responsible for rebuilding New York. He's also partly responsible for making New York a healthier and better place for most of the people in New York. Not all, most. It's really quite something when you think of that. So, at one and the same time he was running Chase Manhattan and Rockefeller Institute which is really Rockefeller University. It is a University, it isn't a foundation, in fact.