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Now, as we talk about his relationship with political leaders, try to remember what he might have said to you about them, or anything, you know, that you experienced directly, as well as just your--what you learned. For example, what do you know about his relationship with Ike?

Very little. Nor do I think it was very close. Other than being invited to the White House and, most importantly, getting Clare made Ambassador to Italy, I don't think that was that much of a relationship between Harry and Ike. You know, he spread himself very thin. One of the reasons that I think he didn't have very close relationships with anybody was that he tended always to be on the road. He was having relations with Nehru, and Romulo, and--not De Gaulle, because nobody could [laughs]--but all those personalities. And he was fascinated by the world! And he was always on the move.

What about with Nixon, whom he first knew as Vice President? As a matter of fact, he never knew him as President.

I don't know, but I cannot imagine Harry and Nixon even carrying on a five minute conversation.

[laughs] Why?

Because Harry would have gone right into the stratosphere, and Nixon would have gone right into the bowels of the earth.