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set, who in normal life wouldn't appear in bright colors. Now that's fallen away, except in certain political situations, where the woman with the red dress gets a lot of attention and this certainly is true in news conferences and things of that kind. You'll find correspondents showing up with bright colors. This is more apt to happen with the women on news than it is with the men. But even the men -- I notice, in a lot of the interviews with political leaders, you'll find them wearing red ties or things of that kind, which, twenty years ago or before color television, they wore pretty drab ties.

So, it's a world of color we live in and television is reflecting that.

To backtrack also a little bit to last time -- you spoke about how Mr. Paley's raids, star raids, in '48 and '49, from NBC, really helped bring profits to CBS at a time when they really needed them. Would you say that CBS television -- I mean, CBS radio, at that point, in making a transition into television, was based on a star system, at least on the entertainment side?

It's always been based on a star system.

And that's what brought in the profits.

I'm sorry?

That's what brought in the profits.

Well, that's what brought in the circulation, and if you get circulation, you get