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the other is the East/West reporting. In my dreams last night I said to myself if they do have a hearing, I think I'm going to ask, as a citizen, to be a witness, and reopen some of the things that I'm talking about now. I probably won't, because I don't think I have the physical stamina to do it, but it would be interesting to replay some of these ideas on Congress.

I don't think -- This is unfair. I question whether [Albert] Gore will support what I'm talking about, because Gore is not in favor of the debates. [William J.] Clinton, I think, is. I don't think the Republicans, constitutionally, are. I got a lot of criticism from the Republicans in '60, I guess, when one of my arguments was, this brings both sides under the tent, so you expose one to the other, and it will increase the voter turnout, the voter registration and the voter participation. Almost to a man, on the Republican side, privately, they said that's a bad thing, because you're going to have the riffraff voting, the blacks and the Hispanics will be in the mix, and we don't need them.

Isn't that interesting.

I got that even in the business community. “Let's not let the bastards in.” It's scary.

Yes, it's very scary. [Interruption] We're going to talk a little bit about the role of Sam Rayburn in the debate.

In 1960, when we were trying to get the legislation on temporary resolution through, it was easy to make progress in the Senate, and I had the support of Magnuson