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Yes. To go back to --

You want another example of it: I was reading something the other day about the mural that was painted for the lobby of the RCA Building. They ripped it down. The Rockefeller family took the canvas down because the artist was a Mexican, as I recall, I've forgotten his name now, clearly a member of the -- by his own admission, a member of the Communist Party. And they simply didn't want the art in the building to have that -- and that goes back to 1932. It had nothing to do with the war.

I'm sure I used illustrators for a lot of our advertising in print -- we used illustrators or artists who were sympathetic and probably active in the Communist Party. If some of the people had known that they were, I probably would have caught hell for that too. But I didn't judge them on the basis of their politics, I was supportive of the art director for the selection of them for their art.

Would I have taken a known Communist architect for an office building? Probably not. I don't think there's that much -- there is a difference between architects, but I think I could have found a suitable architect who probably didn't have those leanings. This is totally off the beam anyway, but --

Well, to get back to the development of news and public affairs programming. What was the format of the news in this period, and were there ten-to-fifteen minute broadcasts, thirty- minute broadcasts?